Curse

Celes Tial · Jul 20, 2005, 09:42 AM // 09:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zeru

This thread seems to be rivaling this one http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...1&page=1&pp=25 in terms of incorrect information.

Remember nobody is saying bad stuff against necro secondary. Rend is invaluable and several other spells are quite useful but the primary itself is not worth it 90% or more of the time in pvp.

Thank you for adding to the pool of incorrect information.

I guess you were not there when my necro primary took out half of the enemy team in Tombs a couple days ago, totally turning the outcome of the fight. 3 clicks at no energy cost, instant cast, 4 dead people in 5 seconds.

Maybe you'll figure out how I did it, but with that 'primary necros suck' attitude you probably wontnt.

As for soul reaping - it is possible to have it triggered 15 times in a single 2 minute battle with people who keep getting rezed, which happens quite often unless one of the teams is extremely bad. At 9+1 soul reaping, that is an extra 150 energy in 2 minutes. And thats just with 2 teams... imagine a 3rd team adding to the death pool. The area of effect for soul reaping is quite large.

ManaCraft · Jul 20, 2005, 02:40 PM // 14:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by theclam

Plus the fact that once three deaths have occured, one team probably already would have a big advantage.

In GvG you will be resurrected regularly. In HoH you will be resurected regularly. In the six way map with the priest (Burial Mounds I think) you will be resurrected regularly. In an altar match you will be resurrected regularly if your hero controls the altar. In relic runs you will .... well, I hope you get the point by now.

And add to that the frequent presence of resurrection signets, which any player with half a brain will bring (and any team that knows what it's doing will kill frozen soil if it's up and they need to rez). Three deaths aren't hard to come by in 8v8 pvp, nor do three deaths mean the end of the match.

Arenas are of course another matter.

ManaCraft

Mithie · Jul 20, 2005, 02:52 PM // 14:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by salja Wachi

ummm dude three words NECROS DON'T TANK!!!

guys like you not knowing how to play your class are responsible for the problems newer necros have in getting groups.

My N/Mo disagrees. Aura of the Lich + demonic flesh + life siphon + shielding hands = what? Your warrior can't do damage faster than my regen? Well, you don't say...

I won't even talk about the N/W, which as can be seen, is my primary character.

hobo13 · Jul 20, 2005, 02:59 PM // 14:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blackace

no Zrave necros are still pretty bad overall

you should try going up against a decent one, or playing against one. you know as well as i know that everyone hates fighting necros in PVE as much as they hate mesmers, some hate them even more. people overlook the massive damage the proper necro can deal. no matter what your class, i can make a necro build to screw you the hell up!
people view blood magic as the best necro attribute because it does straight up damage and the wells. aside from the wells and awaken the blood, blood magic is crap in pvp.

i believe necros are best at cursing, imagine being a warior, and whenever you attack you take 71 damae and the necro is healed for 23 of it, if you miss(you have 25% chance to) you take about 80 damage. you take about 45 damage whenever you attack or use a skill, that damage is to you and surrounding foes all of these effects last for 21 seconds. thats only using 3 skills. plus the 45 somthing damage skill is almost spammable, i can usually hit all the warriors with that combo before the effects of the first wear off. i could also slow your attack speed by 50% and give you health degen of 3 for 41 seconds, 1 skill. if i wanted too, i could add another skill for casters, give them mana degen of 2. or i could switch elites to that they lose all enchantments, and only get half healing for 21 seconds.

with an anti caster build i could give mana degen of 4 and life degen of 4 with 3 skills.
necros are awesome characters if you know how to use them. people just like their character to be able to fend for itself if they use PVE. cursing isnt the bet at that. however, if an axe or sword warrior runs up to me and tries to take me out in PVP. i send him running on back to his monk in a flash. while he is runing, i desecrate his enchantments and kill him. the joy of necros is that everyone thinks they suck, so when a team who knows they are good has a good one, the team objective becomes kill the necro really realy fast.

Keegan · Jul 20, 2005, 03:43 PM // 15:43

i havent read this whole thread, but i'd like to say that, as a monk, having a necro secondary is extremely helpful. Shadow of Fear is an amazingly powerful spell, with nothing in curses, it reduces a group's attack speed by 50% for 20 seconds.

Not to mention blood ritual, well of power, and some others. I'm a well balanced monk, i have nearly equal parts in healing, divine, and protection. The added benefeit of shadow of fear just makes me...uber.

BurningPants · Jul 20, 2005, 03:48 PM // 15:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by ComMan

Because Fast Casting affects recharge time.

If you're an N/E, N/Me, or N/Mo then you probably are going down the wrong route though.

N/Mo with martyr and plague touch can be pretty good, just pack some self condition spells (chilblains etc.) with your normal disease spells, let them pile up on your team and spam the plague touch? no?

Teufel Eldritch · Jul 20, 2005, 03:57 PM // 15:57

You like Shadow of Fear? Try Enfeebling Blood as well. Enfeebling Blood severely weakens the target(& other hostiles around it). The main drawbacks that I have noticed with Enfeebling Blood are...

1) Health sacrifice. Not to big a deal but does make it so you have to pay more attention to health management.

2) It isn't a Hex spell. Not really a BIG problem but if you are using a spell that does more damage to a hexed foe(IE: the Elite Feast of Corruption) then EB wont work in that regard.

3) Duration. Even with a 16 in Curses it only lasts 21 seconds.

Don't let these drawbacks prevent you from using it tho. It can come in really handy. I kinda see it as the Necro version of the Monk spell Protective Spirit, but instead of casting on a teammie you cast it against the enemy.

salja Wachi · Jul 20, 2005, 04:20 PM // 16:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mithie

My N/Mo disagrees. Aura of the Lich + demonic flesh + life siphon + shielding hands = what? Your warrior can't do damage faster than my regen? Well, you don't say...

I won't even talk about the N/W, which as can be seen, is my primary character.

of course yo will not talk about it since you have no clue on how to play a necro.

a necro is not a tank period end of story.

let us know when yo ulearn how to plya a good necro and we wil llisten

Mithie · Jul 20, 2005, 04:24 PM // 16:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by salja Wachi

of course yo will not talk about it since you have no clue on how to play a necro.

a necro is not a tank period end of story.

let us know when yo ulearn how to plya a good necro and we wil llisten

Heaven forbid we think outside of the box. The fact of the matter is, the necro CAN tank, and tank well, at that. Instead of embracing the paradigm that nec's can't tank, about about you provide some convincing evidence?

With aura of the lich every arrow of hp regen = practically two arrows of hp regen, for a total of 20 pips of hp regen. I can tank right through any conditions you put on me through plague touch, and my armor class (70) isn't as low as a mes or ele's amor. Also, I can constantly pound out blood sacrifices as Aura of the Lich = 75% reduction on blood sacrificed.

Maybe, instead of flaming me, you tell me why this build won't be able to tank alongside a warrior.

Let us know when you learn how to type and we will listen. Flames aren't needed, by the way, and I don't appreciate them.

Azreal911 · Jul 20, 2005, 04:24 PM // 16:24

The fun necro spell to have in random arena`s are plague touch. i think it`s a 3/4 sec casting time. and when ever someone poisons, bleeds, diseases me I just throw it back in their face and run off since the damage has been done already and try focusing on the called target (sometimes someone calls actually!) it's like a real quick counter to those attacks that give you a condition. there's another one spell like that but with range instead but it's slow.

sambotheman · Jul 20, 2005, 04:31 PM // 16:31

now i have started a e/n a week ago and i have to say it is extremly powerfull ( this is only in pve but i will defenitly use it in pve) and i was considering a either a n/e or e/n and i think in ceratin situations SR could be better eg when there is 3 teams in a battle at once in the tombs but then i thought that most decent spells require 15 or so energy and thats why i decided to go for but if they do bring out skills for SR i will defiently make a n/e char

Mithie · Jul 20, 2005, 04:36 PM // 16:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by sambotheman

now i have started a e/n a week ago and i have to say it is extremly powerfull ( this is only in pve but i will defenitly use it in pve) and i was considering a either a n/e or e/n and i think in ceratin situations SR could be better eg when there is 3 teams in a battle at once in the tombs but then i thought that most decent spells require 15 or so energy and thats why i decided to go for but if they do bring out skills for SR i will defiently make a n/e char

Whether you go n/e or e/n depends on whether you want to be a primary damage dealer or a support character. If you want to constantly put out aoe or spike damage, go with e/n, because that way, you can get a good, constant feed of energy and a deep enough reserve that a few mesmer inspiration spells won't drain you dry. If you want to be a support character, then you might want to consider n/e for two reasons: 1. runes, and 2. When people start dying on both sides, that's when you really need to hit off your support spells, and unlike en storage, soul reaping gives you that juice in bulk and bursts, letting you hit the support spell right away.

PieXags · Jul 20, 2005, 04:42 PM // 16:42

It all just comes down to opinion, I personally adore the blood/curses lines, and I switch between inspiration and illusion magic as the attribute for my secondary depending on what I'm going for. I'm a necro primary because I think necros look a hell of a lot cooler than mesmers. And having an attribute over 12 in both blood and curses to me, is worth it. Afterall I've found a few good builds using mostly necro spells alone, so why shouldn't I be that class as a primary? It looks cool, I'm able to boost up the attributes of my main skills, it fits. End of story for me. If you don't want any help from a necromancer don't party with one, if you find yourself hexed all to hell to the point that you can hardly do anything, by a N/Me, great, no matter.

Any primary class in the game can be good, we all know this. Necros are just as useful in PvE as they are in PvP, and hell...they're fun to play. So why all the arguing...?

Sammiel · Jul 20, 2005, 04:48 PM // 16:48

To downplay the role of runes and armor in selection of a class is idiotic. A necro in AL70 armor takes 84% of the damage an elementalist in AL60 does in the average case. In addition the jump from 12 blood to 16 is just as useful as the jump from 12 air to 16. Those downplaying it are out of their minds.

In addition in any long match Energy Storage is going to be nigh on worthless. The extra power pool will quickly be used up, leaving you at the same point as any other caster. Not that soul reaping is super extra awesome, but neither is energy storage. And relying on ether renewal is unlikely to be very effective. A good team should have no problem stripping the enchantments off of an elementalist, leaving them with an elite that is worthless much of the time.

Forboding Angel · Jul 20, 2005, 05:05 PM // 17:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by salja Wachi

ummm dude three words NECROS DON'T TANK!!!

guys like you not knowing how to play your class are responsible for the problems newer necros have in getting groups.

Actually necro's can tank very well, do you have any idea how much life we steal and regen? Hell I can put myself at full health with 2 spells.

Celes Tial · Jul 20, 2005, 05:34 PM // 17:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sammiel

To downplay the role of runes and armor in selection of a class is idiotic. A necro in AL70 armor takes 84% of the damage an elementalist in AL60 does in the average case.

Why is everyone so obsessed with that necro armor? Seriously. If you think a weakness against holy does not matter in PvP, then you dont know much about GW PvP.

Smiter builds are quite popular at the moment.

sino-soviet · Jul 20, 2005, 06:44 PM // 18:44

Why do people still believe that all of the classes can be just as good as any other if used correctly? A necromancer as a primary can be decent, and can fill a specific team role (BIP). But otherwise, its a shallow class which has less to offer than the others.

Celes Tial · Jul 20, 2005, 06:48 PM // 18:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by sino-soviet

Why do people still believe that all of the classes can be just as good as any other if used correctly? A necromancer as a primary can be decent, and can fill a specific team role (BIP). But otherwise, its a shallow class which has less to offer than the others.

You dont listen to others at all, do you?

I think several of the experienced necro players who posted here could prove you wrong, but if you refuse to listen to anything but your own arguments, you will never see the truth.

Or maybe you will once your entire team falls to the feet of a necro bomb guild group.

salja Wachi · Jul 20, 2005, 07:09 PM // 19:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by Forboding Angel

Actually necro's can tank very well, do you have any idea how much life we steal and regen? Hell I can put myself at full health with 2 spells.

lol do i know?? my primary character is a N/Mo, with over 2 million experience on that character alone, so yet i know esactly what most necro spells do, (i would add better thatn you do)

that being said a necro is not a tank. plain and simple. use it as a tank if you want in PvE i could care less cause that is mot important. i am talking about PvP. where your necro will die a very fast and painful death if you try to tank with it against even a semi skilled team.

Mithie · Jul 20, 2005, 07:10 PM // 19:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by sino-soviet

Why do people still believe that all of the classes can be just as good as any other if used correctly? A necromancer as a primary can be decent, and can fill a specific team role (BIP). But otherwise, its a shallow class which has less to offer than the others.

Turning enemy HP into energy for your own team is just one of the many roles necroes can play. As I've said before, there's no "general purpose" necro build, but when tailored correctly, the necro can counter any specific tactic you can throw.